(Questions) Gears for PE / Industrial / Drone / Dark-Ambient

Talk about music gear for noise music

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Kla2z1
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(Questions) Gears for PE / Industrial / Drone / Dark-Ambient

Post by Kla2z1 » Mon Dec 03, 2018 3:48 am

Hello,
new member here and I'm from Taiwan.

I've been listening / creating noise for a while,
I used to make sound with laptop, but I found analog is more interesting,
so I bought a monotribe, some pedals, contact mics, it's fun ,but I want do more, so I'm here for suggestions.

My works are mainly dark-ambient with industrial sound, some screaming vocals with contact mics,
and I would like to know how to achieve these sound with analog gear,
for example, like sound of Puce Mary / Pan Daijing / Naked / all of artist from TRAPDOOR TAPES.

I've been looking for MS20, Microbrute, would like to know any suggestion with these two or other gear that might suitable for me,
really appreciate.

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jliat
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Re: (Questions) Gears for PE / Industrial / Drone / Dark-Ambient

Post by jliat » Mon Dec 03, 2018 5:29 am

IMO for dark ambient, industrial etc. a good reverb and echo are perhaps as or more important than an array of synths. And perhaps some means of field recording.

I expect you will get more detailed advice from others.

I've used Roland rack echoes / reverbs but I had a Yamaha Rev5 which was referred to by the sales guy as "The donkey's knob"...

You seem to ge able to get these on ebay...

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killing raven sun
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Re: (Questions) Gears for PE / Industrial / Drone / Dark-Ambient

Post by killing raven sun » Mon Dec 03, 2018 6:22 am

fair warning about jliat...
jliat wrote:
Thu Nov 29, 2018 8:46 am
Absolutely do not pretend to know much about the "noise scene". I'm interesred in the genre for
various reasons and have made some noise pieces. Again noise doesn't require talent. But if someone wants to
agonise for days over a track, fine. Somone else used the term, not mine, polishing turds.

dark ambient and industrial are best identified by the sound source, not effects, so focus on making the sound first then blend carefully, getting the right sounds may take counterintuitive measures, ring mods can be great if you use them right, as for delay and atmosphere make sure your processors can handle low frequencies, adds lots of umph

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jliat
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Re: (Questions) Gears for PE / Industrial / Drone / Dark-Ambient

Post by jliat » Mon Dec 03, 2018 7:06 am

killing raven sun wrote:
Mon Dec 03, 2018 6:22 am
fair warning about jliat...
Jliat
Real Name:
James Whitehead
Profile:
British electronic musician Jliat (James Whitehead) is one of the most radical followers of John Cage's anti-musical ideology. His pieces rarely dwell in the audible spectrum: they either indulge in absolute cacophony or in absolute quiescence. - Discogs


A self-styled “noise theoritician”, Whitehead’s exploration of noise goes way beyond mere sonics into the realm of conceptual ideas and metaphysical realities. Under the nom de guerre JLIAT, Whitehead has been exploring the possibilities of noise and non-music for nearly 20 years, through works that are beautiful, frivolous, confounding, impossible, ridiculous, but never pointless—in fact they almost always pack a hefty sting in their tail. Whitehead’s 30-minute talk could have done with being three times as long; in a way, the title of his paper managed both to encapsulate and undermine everything we had heard and discussed through the previous three days:

‘Un-sounding music; noise is not sound’.- Noise In And As Music conference, organised by Einbond and Aaron Cassidy, which took place at Huddersfield University’s Centre for Research in New Music (CeReNeM)


BBC Radio 3
Brevity
The Listening Service
Tom Service explores brevity in music in the company of sonic artist JLIAT who has made a piece lasting 1/44100th of a second.

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WhiteWarlock
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Re: (Questions) Gears for PE / Industrial / Drone / Dark-Ambient

Post by WhiteWarlock » Mon Dec 03, 2018 8:08 am

in other words the clueless git wanker jackass shouldn't be giving advice about dark ambient/industrial/power electronics
yet he sure does have a gigantic undeserving fake rock staresque ego playing noise scene elder
seriously you would be far better off without any of Jliat's advice
his "work" tends being utter total quintessential poseur shit
+1000 real korg ms20(not the mini re-issue)
yet guess you make the mini work.. Jliat owns one and he can't
whatever gets you there for making the sounds in your head
avoid buying behringer junk
you can do vox so that is obviously massive advantage

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jliat
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Re: (Questions) Gears for PE / Industrial / Drone / Dark-Ambient

Post by jliat » Mon Dec 03, 2018 8:36 am

I also had a Roland SDE-330 which was very smooth... you can pick these up also on ebay..

as for Vox (voice) using a throat mike which you can pick up cheap on ebay and running that through echo reverb
you can get some very 'nice' sounds. I used an ex military one - from a tank commanders through the filter reverb
of a synthi AKS. But things have moved on - this you might want to watch some of the demos...

Roland AIRA Series VT-3 Voice Transformer has some good effects and the reverb is nice - i had one of these...


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timdrage
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Re: (Questions) Gears for PE / Industrial / Drone / Dark-Ambient

Post by timdrage » Mon Dec 03, 2018 8:45 am

Fair warning about everyone in this board: we are the kind of people who would stick around on a pretty much dead noise forum to give newcomers gear advice/sarcasm, argue amongst ourselves and post billions of dumb/crazy/racist/facist/anti-facist conspiracy theories :mrgreen:
dark-ambient with industrial sound, some screaming vocals with contact mics,
and I would like to know how to achieve these sound with analog gear,
This is pretty much the easiest thing in the world to achieve with analog gear (echo and reverb will be digital tho really) so you are in luck :D

Getting a good (doesn't need to be amazing tho) mixer with 2 or more FX sends is more important than specific fancy or designed-for-noise pedals or synths
Pan Daijing
the record i found when quickly googling the name right noise isn't noise or dark ambient at all but rather vocal improv + piano/acoustic/synth. ??? maybe consider getting some sampler or digital piano / rompler for realistic instrument sound? or a real piano if you have the space, don't know how it is over there but here they have negative financial value and can easily be got free if you have the transport. plus you can do things like attach speakers + pickups to the piano harp to use as a kind of weird spring reverb instrument :

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Misomusist
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Re: (Questions) Gears for PE / Industrial / Drone / Dark-Ambient

Post by Misomusist » Mon Dec 03, 2018 11:38 am

Ignoring all the arguing, I'd second having some reverb and delay pedal at hand.

And maybe some modulation, something that can swoosh like a phaser or flanger.

Doesn't need to be fancy, I have some Danelectro and Rockteck stuff and a couple of old Ibanez rack delays.
I think trying to quantify music is one of the biggest wastes of time in the world, like discussing your favourite colour or deity or pizza topping. People should realise that and get on with their life.

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melkobukva
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Re: (Questions) Gears for PE / Industrial / Drone / Dark-Ambient

Post by melkobukva » Mon Dec 03, 2018 12:54 pm

analog you say...








Kla2z1
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Re: (Questions) Gears for PE / Industrial / Drone / Dark-Ambient

Post by Kla2z1 » Tue Dec 04, 2018 11:38 am

Wow thanks for all the advices!

I'm not really an English speaker so it takes me some time to read slowly and try understands it all.
I've read all you kind people's reply, and here's something I'd like to reply:

As for delay or echo, I've got a DD-7, and Zoom RFX-300, other pedals are Deathmetal/MT-2....something like that
so maybe I've find another reverb? is there any recommendation ?

and for Pan Daijing, here are some clips that might more alike to what I want(maybe)
https://youtu.be/CAWJ2PO1V_g
https://youtu.be/3rxD3XjlcJc


But there's one thing that I'm afraid of,
in my country, there's really very very very little amount of gear,
I mean, those gear from small company do not even exist in my country,
but I'll check Japan's secondhand online market anyway,
(I'll go ask my friend where did he got his KNAS Ekdahl Moisturizer)

I'll go try MS-20 mini at store these days,
one more question, will you recommend gear from Bastl?

Thank you all a lot.

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melkobukva
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Re: (Questions) Gears for PE / Industrial / Drone / Dark-Ambient

Post by melkobukva » Tue Dec 04, 2018 4:07 pm

If you are able to order from Japan, you should have no problems getting anything :)

How much are you willing to spend? Are you comfortable with big heavy FX boxes, or do you need a compact portable setup? Do you require the unit to be easily tweakable on the fly (i.e. a knobby pedal)?

Some semi-random thoughts on topic of reverbs etc....

Zoom MS-70CDR is a decent affordable delay/reverb/modulation pedal.
Useful half rack boxes: BOSS SE-50 & 70, Yamaha FX500 & 550, Lexicon LXP-1 & 5, Sony HR-GP5 & MP-5

Pretty much any 80s or 90s rackmount unit from a well known brand (Roland, Yamaha, Sony, Lexicon, Ensoniq, AKAI, Kurzweil, TC Electronic, Ibanez/Maxon, BOSS, Digitech, Alesis, Zoom, Fostex, Dynacord, etc, etc, etc) should do the job. Just see what's available for a good price and then read about the model & watch the demos on YT.

Also, look out for Lexicon Vortex. Those things can do wicked stuff and usually cost under $100, but they are somewhat rare.

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WhiteWarlock
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Re: (Questions) Gears for PE / Industrial / Drone / Dark-Ambient

Post by WhiteWarlock » Tue Dec 04, 2018 4:24 pm

+100 on Useful half rack boxes: BOSS SE-50 & 70, Yamaha FX500 & 550, Lexicon LXP-1 & 5,
+1000 on Lexicon Vortex they are getting super rare anymore
you can design you own noise generators and order components from HK/china

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timdrage
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Re: (Questions) Gears for PE / Industrial / Drone / Dark-Ambient

Post by timdrage » Wed Dec 05, 2018 2:00 am

But there's one thing that I'm afraid of,
in my country, there's really very very very little amount of gear,
I mean, those gear from small company do not even exist in my country,
all the great pioneers of noise/industrial/PE made their music with muuuch less gear than is available in even a gear-starved country today :) just get what you can and experiment! anything that amplifies or creates sound in any way.

playing back and recording sounds in a real-life sonically interesting space beats digital reverb pedals any day

OH and do you have any links to your recordings? would be cool to hear and would help us suggest gear which would be suitable

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jliat
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Re: (Questions) Gears for PE / Industrial / Drone / Dark-Ambient

Post by jliat » Wed Dec 05, 2018 2:56 am

You might also try looking at this https://www.korg.com/us/products/dj/mini_kaoss_pad2/

It has delays and reverbs, ring mod, grain shifter filters etc (all digital though) but you control the effects from a touch pad, so very
interactive... You should be able to get a demo if you have a Korg dealer... + battery powered, takes sd cards which you can play
from and record to... though the microphone for recording on mine is useless... my only criticism.


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Fletcher
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Re: (Questions) Gears for PE / Industrial / Drone / Dark-Ambient

Post by Fletcher » Wed Dec 05, 2018 7:08 am

One thing I have learnt so far is


Idea > Gear
www.snarerush.co.uk
An electronic music zine in occasional print format

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