Censorship in China/EU/UK/US is a Nightmare

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jliat
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Re: Censorship in China/EU/UK/US is a Nightmare

Post by jliat » Sat Oct 13, 2018 11:23 pm

WhiteWarlock wrote:
Sat Oct 13, 2018 3:25 pm
LOFLBWAHAHAHAHA he thinks that he is in "The Music Business"
Where did you get that idea? You seem to just make stuff up then think its my thoughts... like
socialism and stuff. Crazy man. Maybe you were in the industry but I doubt it. As you hide from
any publicity - no where to be found in Discogs… etc. So maybe a phantasy of your making IDK.
WhiteWarlock wrote:
Sat Oct 13, 2018 3:25 pm
OMFGs not as if he ever worked in any capacity for the "Industry" in his life
Neither have you - its obvious. No CV. But to be clear I've never worked in the music
industry.
Though Rough Trade owe me £2,000.00 :wall:
WhiteWarlock wrote:
Sat Oct 13, 2018 3:25 pm
this is part of the reasons why it becomes impossible taking him seriously at all anymore
The reason you cant take me seriously - if taking people seriously is your thing- is that you fail to
follow what I say but fabricate your own ideas - such as the above.

To be clear - I never earnt a living in the music industry. Or ever wanted to. And where I live now we are surrounded it seems by people who did and do. Next door, one guy was a Roadie for Van Morrison amongst others.. , the other guy owns a violin shop and he makes electric violins, he has even sold one to Nigel Kennedy. (have you heard of him?) So I could ask them if you have any questions. There are it seems some quite nasty people in the industry i'm told... ;)

There is a tendency for some to be bitter and sad as they never made the big time, now in their late 50s 60s playing for free old rock.. that said I used to drink in the same pub as Jeff Lynn (sp?) and a while ago I met Robert Plant, he's into horrible folk music - banjos! I hate banjos...

But In the main many are sad losers and bitter for not making it big and living in the past - bit old hippy.. and the drugs have obviously had some effect... sounds familiar Mr Warlock? I truly hope not.

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melkobukva
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Re: Censorship in China/EU/UK/US is a Nightmare

Post by melkobukva » Sun Oct 14, 2018 3:05 am

jliat wrote:
Sat Oct 13, 2018 10:57 pm
melkobukva wrote:
Sat Oct 13, 2018 3:05 pm
jliat wrote:
Fri Oct 12, 2018 11:03 pm
Why is it assumed " a given" that privacy is a good thing? (especially in the music business! )
What's so special about the music business?

Well not 'special' in any sense of more significant, but in that within such industries publicity is normally sort after. Same goes
for being in any entertainment business unless its banned, in which case some secrecy us required. But in other activities, privacy is more important, So crooks tend to want to keep secret the source of their wealth.

I've been reading Will Thonhill (Electric Universe Guy) who is very into 'common sense'. Just a thought - surely in any entertainment business which is legal publicity trumps privacy?
:roll:
Sometimes anonymity is used as a marketing schtick. For example, a rather famous band Ghost officially consists of 'nameless ghouls'.

Sometimes (online) anonymity is required to avoid bad publicity by separating the artist from the music. Expressing 'wrong' opinions online can hurt your business, this already happened to a lot of people.

What is really being publicized is the musical brand, not the person behind it. Unless the person is not the brand (cf. Taylor Swift), there is no contradiction between publicity and privacy.

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Re: Censorship in China/EU/UK/US is a Nightmare

Post by jliat » Sun Oct 14, 2018 3:45 am

melkobukva wrote:
Sun Oct 14, 2018 3:05 am
jliat wrote:
Sat Oct 13, 2018 10:57 pm
melkobukva wrote:
Sat Oct 13, 2018 3:05 pm


What's so special about the music business?

Well not 'special' in any sense of more significant, but in that within such industries publicity is normally sort after. Same goes
for being in any entertainment business unless its banned, in which case some secrecy us required. But in other activities, privacy is more important, So crooks tend to want to keep secret the source of their wealth.

I've been reading Will Thonhill (Electric Universe Guy) who is very into 'common sense'. Just a thought - surely in any entertainment business which is legal publicity trumps privacy?
:roll:
Sometimes anonymity is used as a marketing schtick. For example, a rather famous band Ghost officially consists of 'nameless ghouls'.
I've never heard of them!

"Tobias Forge – vocals (2008–present)
Papa Emeritus – vocals (2008–2012)
Papa Emeritus II – vocals (2012–2015)
Papa Emeritus III – vocals, kazoo (2015–2017)
Cardinal Copia – vocals (2018–present)
Nameless Ghouls – guitars, bass, drums, keyboards, backing vocals
Papa Nihil – saxophone (2018–present)"

Seems just the backing players then - hardly new Gladys knight and the pips! Oh not their real names - like Ringo then?
melkobukva wrote:
Sun Oct 14, 2018 3:05 am

Sometimes (online) anonymity is required to avoid bad publicity by separating the artist from the music. Expressing 'wrong' opinions online can hurt your business, this already happened to a lot of people.
Examples? More often its hiding illegal activity. Examples - Pete Townsend - some UK high court judges etc. Wiki leaks - I can see why anonymity in certain cases is wanted- to avoid punishment, but it also avoids responsibility. So you think Wiki leaks guy should go to jail?
melkobukva wrote:
Sun Oct 14, 2018 3:05 am
What is really being publicized is the musical brand, not the person behind it. Unless the person is not the brand (cf. Taylor Swift), there is no contradiction between publicity and privacy.
PLEASE. Lady Diana FFS. Film due out soon about Queen... or err what was the guys name?

And has the thought that pop stars sometimes are not a brand manufactured but individuals expressing their views? Any milage now?


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melkobukva
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Re: Censorship in China/EU/UK/US is a Nightmare

Post by melkobukva » Sun Oct 14, 2018 6:56 am

jliat wrote:
Sun Oct 14, 2018 3:45 am
Seems just the backing players then - hardly new Gladys knight and the pips! Oh not their real names - like Ringo then?
I agree. Of course, 'privacy' is nothing new in the music business.

Image
Examples? More often its hiding illegal activity.
https://www.vibe.com/2018/04/sabrina-cl ... es-racist/
https://www.billboard.com/articles/news ... nts-tweets
https://www.theguardian.com/world/2015/ ... sa-concert
https://www.businessinsider.com/ulf-ekb ... ies-2013-4
https://www.theguardian.com/music/2018/ ... rimination
http://tasteofcountry.com/shania-twain- ... for-trump/

Wrongthink = bad for business.
Film due out soon about Queen... or err what was the guys name?
A counter-question: can you name all Deep Purple frontmen without googling?
Some bands are linked to particular people, sometimes one, sometimes two, sometimes more. On the other hand there bands that succesfully go on having literally zero members from the original lineup.

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Re: Censorship in China/EU/UK/US is a Nightmare

Post by jliat » Sun Oct 14, 2018 7:37 am

melkobukva wrote:
Sun Oct 14, 2018 6:56 am


A counter-question: can you name all Deep Purple frontmen without googling?
Some bands are linked to particular people, sometimes one, sometimes two, sometimes more. On the other hand there bands that succesfully go on having literally zero members from the original lineup.
Deep Purple - no. I only ever had the one LP back in 1971. A brief foray into Heavy Metal. Not my scene. Counter question - what bands did Eric Clapton*play in. I did check out Ghost - again not my thing - kind of Black Sab / Eurovision. Ozzie Osborne, a fellow Brummie! He's from Aston, now mostly M6 motorway... Black Sab 46 years ago and kids still trying to play like them - strange world. Compare that with popular music of 1924. Something's happened.


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=aCgkLICTskQ&t=1520s

*i'll allow The Beatles as one. it was him on gently weeps. And phil collins played tom tom on My Sweet Lord. But that wasnt a Beatles LP.
Harrison was in at least two bands... the last i never remember - swinging blue berries or something.

"On the other hand there bands that succesfully go on having literally zero members from the original lineup. "

But you googled!! in order to do this.

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Re: Censorship in China/EU/UK/US is a Nightmare

Post by WhiteWarlock » Sun Oct 14, 2018 7:53 am

Ian Gillian... he also sang on Black Sabbath born again in 82/83?(when got the tape)... the MTV video for the album is "Trashed"
way massively prefer him with Blackmoore/Lord than Iommi/Butler... "child in time" epic classic
Burn is good record IMO yet even Blackmoore didn't really consider hughes & coverdale "deep purple" so he started new band
plus they all ended up so strung out playing deep purple goes funk until Bolin ended up dead
there's also some other original singer yet we won't name him due to long legal disputes that memory holed him from all royalties
next
Clapton... Yardbirds with Jimmy Page... then Cream with Jack Bruce & Ginger... don't care so much about him after that
no google required



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Re: Censorship in China/EU/UK/US is a Nightmare

Post by jliat » Sun Oct 14, 2018 8:39 am

WhiteWarlock wrote:
Sun Oct 14, 2018 7:53 am

Clapton... Yardbirds with Jimmy Page... then Cream with Jack Bruce & Ginger... don't care so much about him after that
no google required
i'd got these but also with John Mayall And Derek etc.
But using wiki-

The Roosters
Casey Jones & the Engineers
Yarbirds
John Mayall & the Bluesbreakers (everyone did!)
Cream
Harrison's "While My Guitar Gently Weeps" from the Beatles' White Album (I thought So!)
Blind Faith - (christ this takes me back!)
Delaney and Bonnie and Friends.
He also played two dates as a member of the Plastic Ono Band
Derek and the Dominos !!!!


...

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Re: Censorship in China/EU/UK/US is a Nightmare

Post by melkobukva » Sun Oct 14, 2018 8:52 am

jliat wrote:
Sun Oct 14, 2018 7:37 am
But you googled!! in order to do this.
Sure. I knew the band Yes, but had no idea that it had no original members remaining. An example in favor of my point. Not every band has to be equated to particular band members.

And to take this point to the extreme...
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mariinsky_Ballet
How many original members have remained since 1740? Not much, most likely :D

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Re: Censorship in China/EU/UK/US is a Nightmare

Post by jliat » Sun Oct 14, 2018 9:14 am

melkobukva wrote:
Sun Oct 14, 2018 8:52 am
jliat wrote:
Sun Oct 14, 2018 7:37 am
But you googled!! in order to do this.
Sure. I knew the band Yes, but had no idea that it had no original members remaining. An example in favor of my point. Not every band has to be equated to particular band members.

And to take this point to the extreme...
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mariinsky_Ballet
How many original members have remained since 1740? Not much, most likely :D

Your point was "What is really being publicized is the musical brand, not the person behind it. "

So you have not made it. In reality its often the case of band members being and names being dynamic. You could have used also football teams, army regiments, or the English royal family. Starts - Alfred the Great King of Wessex 849–871-899

I think you are pushing things with Yes - "Upon joining Yes in 1970, Howe helped to establish the band's change in sound, a change that led to their commercial and critical success.... " So the brand as you say was made by its members.

Anyway a 'nice' argument... I think at the moment there are a least two 'Bay City Rollers' bands. - dont go there!

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Re: Censorship in China/EU/UK/US is a Nightmare

Post by melkobukva » Sun Oct 14, 2018 11:24 am

jliat wrote:
Sun Oct 14, 2018 9:14 am
Your point was "What is really being publicized is the musical brand, not the person behind it. "

So you have not made it.
I'm pretty sure I have. "In reality its often the case of band members being and names being dynamic", i.e. people still listen to Black Sabbath regardless of whether it's fronted by Ozzy or by Ronnie - it's still the Sabbath brand.

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Re: Censorship in China/EU/UK/US is a Nightmare

Post by killing raven sun » Sun Oct 14, 2018 11:32 am

melkobukva wrote:
Sun Oct 14, 2018 11:24 am
Ozzy
the reality show was proof of your point, he wasnt nearly as cool as the image he had built, much of the appeal of sabbath in the early days was the name, sound and rebellious lyrics, the stage show came later when stadium rock ruined heavy metal

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WhiteWarlock
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Re: Censorship in China/EU/UK/US is a Nightmare

Post by WhiteWarlock » Sun Oct 14, 2018 12:47 pm

"rough trade" is a slang term for a masculine working class man who has sex with men (sometimes as a male prostitute)
Did all your records on "Rough Trade" go into cutout bins because they couldn't move the shit?
that could explain somethings

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WhiteWarlock
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Re: Censorship in China/EU/UK/US is a Nightmare

Post by WhiteWarlock » Sun Oct 14, 2018 1:01 pm

Why are you so "thick" at times?
Seems like you constantly try proving your superiority
alas only demonstrating your inferiority much of the time
BTW that supposed 2k you were scammed by rough trade
isn't shit
from my experiences with working "Industry"
you wouldn't believe me if told you the absolute truth anyways
so why bother
not worth my time
believe whatever you want
you obviously do anyway

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Re: Censorship in China/EU/UK/US is a Nightmare

Post by jliat » Sun Oct 14, 2018 11:26 pm

WhiteWarlock wrote:
Sun Oct 14, 2018 12:47 pm
"rough trade" is a slang term for a masculine working class man who has sex with men (sometimes as a male prostitute)
Did all your records on "Rough Trade" go into cutout bins because they couldn't move the shit?
that could explain somethings
No idea of where they went. They "ordered" CDs over a year or two, so one assumes they sold them. I also sold to the USA who paid, except Dutch East India. The odd thing is as i'm not in "The Industry" I wasnt that bothered with payment. But Rough Trade always wanted invoices. A tax thing i guess. Anyway the record / pop industry has a bad reputation...

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Re: Censorship in China/EU/UK/US is a Nightmare

Post by jliat » Sun Oct 14, 2018 11:30 pm

WhiteWarlock wrote:
Sun Oct 14, 2018 1:01 pm
Why are you so "thick" at times?
Seems like you constantly try proving your superiority
alas only demonstrating your inferiority much of the time
You and Daric keep on and on about that - boring, and then claim super human abilities.
I've really no interest in proving anything about myself or you and Daric, I've a good idea,
but i'm not interested in personalities here.
WhiteWarlock wrote:
Sun Oct 14, 2018 1:01 pm
BTW that supposed 2k you were scammed by rough trade
isn't shit
from my experiences with working "Industry"
you wouldn't believe me if told you the absolute truth anyways
so why bother
not worth my time
believe whatever you want
you obviously do anyway
Fine. I wouldnt believe you. You've made quite a few claims - un supported, and mistakes.

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