An external observer

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jliat
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An external observer

Post by jliat » Sun May 20, 2018 3:47 am

"But... when Oliver Tex points at his Soundcloud and labels its contents as 'noise', he is reprimanded. The Noise Experts Who Know Better disapprove. So he should Shut Up and Listen as they school him. For an external observer this looks very much like a power/hierarchy type of thing akin to what Feyerabend wrote about."

And yet an "external observer" by the very act of placing himself or herself on the outside is able to transcend ANY "power/hierarchy type of thing". The realm of such transcendence being that traditionally of the Devine logos.
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melkobukva
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Re: An external observer

Post by melkobukva » Sun May 20, 2018 5:28 am

If the external observer transcends to the realm of the Devine logos, it is only until he is observed back and is thus cast down.

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jliat
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Re: An external observer

Post by jliat » Sun May 20, 2018 6:26 am

Unless of course there is no such transcendental external place to judge from... and to posit such a place is fiction.
The semantic horizon which habitually governs the notion of communication is exceeded or punctured by the intervention of writing, that is of a dissemination which cannot be reduced to a polysemia. Writing is read, and "in the last analysis" does not give rise to a hermeneutic deciphering, to the decoding of a meaning or truth.

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melkobukva
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Re: An external observer

Post by melkobukva » Sun May 20, 2018 3:59 pm

The semantic horizon which habitually governs the notion of communication is exceeded or punctured by the intervention of writing, that is of a dissemination which cannot be reduced to a polysemia. Writing is read, and "in the last analysis" does not give rise to a hermeneutic deciphering, to the decoding of a meaning or truth.
... is read, and "in the last analysis" does not give rise to a hermeneutic deciphering, to the decoding of a meaning or truth.

Knowing that, Dave still wrote and published this. Because the real game is not in hermeneutics, but in power structures.

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jliat
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Re: An external observer

Post by jliat » Sun May 20, 2018 11:43 pm

melkobukva wrote:
Sun May 20, 2018 3:59 pm
The semantic horizon which habitually governs the notion of communication is exceeded or punctured by the intervention of writing, that is of a dissemination which cannot be reduced to a polysemia. Writing is read, and "in the last analysis" does not give rise to a hermeneutic deciphering, to the decoding of a meaning or truth.
... is read, and "in the last analysis" does not give rise to a hermeneutic deciphering, to the decoding of a meaning or truth.

Knowing that, Dave still wrote and published this. Because the real game is not in hermeneutics, but in power structures.
Who is Dave?

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Bonehole
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Re: An external observer

Post by Bonehole » Mon May 21, 2018 3:25 am

Philosophically, I agree with none of these positions. Furthermore, taken out of context as they are, they look like a power/ hierarchy kind of thing.
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melkobukva
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Re: An external observer

Post by melkobukva » Mon May 21, 2018 3:45 am

jliat wrote:
Sun May 20, 2018 11:43 pm
melkobukva wrote:
Sun May 20, 2018 3:59 pm
The semantic horizon which habitually governs the notion of communication is exceeded or punctured by the intervention of writing, that is of a dissemination which cannot be reduced to a polysemia. Writing is read, and "in the last analysis" does not give rise to a hermeneutic deciphering, to the decoding of a meaning or truth.
... is read, and "in the last analysis" does not give rise to a hermeneutic deciphering, to the decoding of a meaning or truth.

Knowing that, Dave still wrote and published this. Because the real game is not in hermeneutics, but in power structures.
Who is Dave?
Some guy with a PhD in Social Theory who quoted Derrida. Never mind.

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jliat
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Re: An external observer

Post by jliat » Mon May 21, 2018 9:40 am

Bonehole wrote:
Mon May 21, 2018 3:25 am
Philosophically, I agree with none of these positions. Furthermore, taken out of context as they are, they look like a power/ hierarchy kind of thing.
OK.


And you dont need to give any reasons for thinking so - but merely having and expressing an opinion isnt doing so 'philosophically'.

(They form part of the ideas behind the change in art and elesewhere within post-modrnity. )

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WhiteWarlock
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Re: An external observer

Post by WhiteWarlock » Mon May 21, 2018 11:17 am

"Academia" & "Hollywood" traditionally has nasty habit
of gutting the real essence of any "underground" movement
stealing anything "Edgy" since they lack real creativity
assimilating so that it can be re-marketed
projected upon collective psyche
for their own social agenda
this is nothing new
when MIT wants you playing noise shows you are probably on the wrong path
are you getting paid grant money yet?
they will pay for your record pressings if it conforms with their rules
and you can play the entire "social art scene game"
They will gladly "dictate" for you
who are paying last FM?

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Re: An external observer

Post by s.p.i.n. » Mon May 21, 2018 12:38 pm



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Bonehole
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Re: An external observer

Post by Bonehole » Mon May 21, 2018 7:59 pm

jliat wrote:
Mon May 21, 2018 9:40 am
[...] merely having and expressing an opinion isnt doing so 'philosophically'.
Yes, it is. I mean, if it isn't, then what is it?

What is philosophy if not having an opinion and/ or expressing it except pretentious?

And what is philosophically pretentious other than a power grab/ heirarchy tetris/ attempt to appear superior?

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jliat
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Re: An external observer

Post by jliat » Tue May 22, 2018 12:37 am

Bonehole wrote:
Mon May 21, 2018 7:59 pm
jliat wrote:
Mon May 21, 2018 9:40 am
[...] merely having and expressing an opinion isnt doing so 'philosophically'.
Yes, it is. I mean, if it isn't, then what is it?
It is merely expressing an opinion. 'I like red wine' is not a philosophical statement. Why? Well the use of 'philosophical' singles out
statements. Some are some are not.
Bonehole wrote:
Mon May 21, 2018 7:59 pm
What is philosophy if not having an opinion and/ or expressing it except pretentious?
It is precisely 'pretentious'. It wants to find universal truths rather than mere opinion, or wants to show that there are no universal truths and everything is just opinion. (that is a universal truth!!)
Bonehole wrote:
Mon May 21, 2018 7:59 pm
And what is philosophically pretentious other than a power grab/ heirarchy tetris/ attempt to appear superior?
Now that is a philosophical question. And though you might say 'attempt to appear', many thought it was the case. 'Aristotle got it right.'
Hume's insignts and scepticism was brilliant. The likes of Locke founded the ideas behind the constitution of America.

God is dead, and there is no morality -all things are permissible - Nietzsche.

And more recently - philosophy is logocentric. The idea that language can express reality is wrong. Phalologocentric, and written by white males...


And that the idea of hierarchies - tree structures are questionable - things are more rhizomic.. Deleuze.

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WhiteWarlock
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Re: An external observer

Post by WhiteWarlock » Tue May 22, 2018 4:54 am

jliat wrote:
Tue May 22, 2018 12:37 am


God is dead, and there is no morality -all things are permissible - Nietzsche.

And more recently - philosophy is logocentric. The idea that language can express reality is wrong. Phalologocentric, and written by white males...


And that the idea of hierarchies - tree structures are questionable - things are more rhizomic.. Deleuze.

why don't you write your own books on philosophy
are you not paying attention at all to the world around you
or so brainwashed that you are blinded
"Phalologocentric, and written by white males..."
sort of annoyed by that comment
glad eye sold those original cage books/manuscripts to thurston moore
they were bad influence
boring was "cool" and "edgy" & "hip" in his day
he was quite the comedian yet they were his counter culture jokes
inventiveness has merit
we aren't here for just replicating Russolo's art of noises
you must spend more time posting philosophy here than actually recording
it gets old & highly counter productive
are you attempting validating your own existence/ego?
merely a question for you reflecting upon
maybe that is far too Harsh
relax
record more
you should start your own "noise podcast"
with analytical philosophical commentary
critiquing/dissecting "noise artistes"
what is and isn't considered "noise" by your standards
it would probably get following
more productive than debating it here constantly

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Dyecap
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Re: An external observer

Post by Dyecap » Tue May 22, 2018 8:39 am


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