My gear/advice wanted

Talk about music gear for noise music

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WhiteWarlock
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Re: My gear/advice wanted

Post by WhiteWarlock » Tue May 01, 2018 10:26 am

& absolutely the price
if paying that much
it better be real gear made of metal
not a super gakken
plus it's SMD/SMT
which is another negative
attempt only buying/fabricating through hole PCB designs
call me "old fashioned" if ya want
yet eye "hate" SMT
even with having SMD Hot Air Rework Station
not slagging your gear...
have my reasons
no like working on them

s.p.i.n.
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Re: My gear/advice wanted

Post by s.p.i.n. » Tue May 01, 2018 10:44 am

WhiteWarlock wrote:
Tue May 01, 2018 10:26 am
& absolutely the price
I kinda like the pocket operators, a couple of those and your in business for almost anything
Last edited by s.p.i.n. on Tue May 01, 2018 10:47 am, edited 1 time in total.


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Bipolar Fucking Joe
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Re: My gear/advice wanted

Post by Bipolar Fucking Joe » Tue May 01, 2018 11:48 am

Yeah, the OP1 never seemed that interesting to me. When "It's battery powered!" is used as a selling point, it sounds like they're struggling to list any others. And it's all menu diving.

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xdugef
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Re: My gear/advice wanted

Post by xdugef » Tue May 01, 2018 11:55 am

drbenway wrote:
Mon Apr 30, 2018 7:15 pm
Is it impossible to make "noise" electronica with these ?
No it is not impossible.

I have an OP1 and I haven't done a huge amount of work with it but it's a fairly powerful device for sampling, sequencing and processing audio.

I suppose probably the biggest drawback to it is that unlike working on a computer you may be limited on how many different tracks you could work on at a time.

In short to make noise electronica.. you need some kind of beat and distortion.. it's not hard. :wall: :wall: :wall: :wall: :wall: :wall: :wall: :wall: :wall: :wall: :wall: :wall: :wall: :wall: :wall: :wall: :wall: :wall: :wall:

>Yeah, the OP1 never seemed that interesting to me. When "It's battery powered!" is used as a selling point, it sounds like they're struggling to list any others. And it's all menu diving.

The OP1 can run off USB power but yes it can also run off battery.

It's not the worst offender as far as menu diving goes and the effects and generative sequencers have some novel and interactively fun ways of working and using the knobs and other controls.

I think the hardest thing about it would be if you were used to working on a computer you would feel confined by it. These days the typical smart phone is powerful enough to be a DAW but would you want to use it as one?? At least the OP1 was engineered for the task to a large degree.

I always wondered what I would have made if instead of having an SK1 as my first sampler back in the 80's if I had gotten an OP1.

Anyway having said that I have not been motivated to force myself to try doing a full composition using just the OP1 because I have so many other devices to play with.

drbenway
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Re: My gear/advice wanted

Post by drbenway » Tue May 01, 2018 3:13 pm

Thanks for all the replies guys, it greatly appreciated! I think you are all definitely right about learning my instruments more. I don't know if this is a typical story around here or not but I used to play guitar but I have been bored with guitar-based music (in general) for years so I put all my instruments down and just went in and out of music. I also created one of the biggest sins a musician could do which is buy gear because one of my hero's uses it. In this case Reggie Watts, who uses both the OP-1 and the littleBits Korg [https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=iEW7e9CZE9I]. The littleBits Korg and the Nintendo Korg didn't cost much so I don't regret them especially since they finally did allow me to test out electronic music thats not a midi in garage band. The OP-1 is definitely powerful enough but I get overwhelmed when I use it and lately have been focusing on the two "Korgs" just to understand synthesizers more in general. But even when I use them I can't get exactly that high pitch tone in my head across in the instruments, it just feels underpowered and I suppose that is what lead me to make the post.
jliat wrote:
Tue May 01, 2018 5:02 am
(IMO) Firstly your list of 'artists' / bands seems very varied, from rap to quite melodic. And “noise” electronica is not that clear. But the more 'musical' electronica covers a wide range, again with specific sounds and structure. And you could certainly make noisy electronica with an OP and the rest.. As for noise in itself then you have more than enough gear. Its a matter of improvising with it to see what you get. Some basic methods of getting noise, overdriving devices, creating feedback loops. The 'creative' part of noise making is just the use and abuse of things... not analytically working towards some sound... concept....

So if anything you have too much gear! I remember someone making a work by recording empty shell cases being rattled in a bucket, keeping the levels well into the red..
I hope when I do produce music it is not imitating any artist, so I thought I would just list what I'm generally into. I definitely agree with you about the creative aspect of making this music and that's what I am enjoying about it so much atm! Regarding working up towards a sound/concept I am most heavily inspired by Haxan Cloaks Excavation and Puce Mary's The Spiral. My biggest goal would be to be able to reproduce live a certain soundscape... although I'm not sure those two reproduce their music live... either way imo both these albums definitely have a certain conceptual soundscape it works through. Loved that video btw fucking awesome.
WhiteWarlock wrote:
Tue May 01, 2018 6:21 am
creative resourcefulness supersedes
rather than typical cuntsumerism traps
of always needing something else for buying
way to chaotic
focus your intent
he needs conceptual clairvoyance
impossible???
try removing your creative limiter...
definitely agree, I'm not looking to buy anything else! I do like to learn about instrument I don't have though and sometimes watch people on youtube play through them. I think I was mostly stuck on not getting the exact sounds I had in my head but I think I'm going to focus on post-production to see how close I can get. Little things such as the tone of a certain synth screech etc.
crochambeau wrote:
Tue May 01, 2018 6:40 am
The difference between "house" and "heavy industrial" or "noise electronica" is not in the gear, it is the way in which the gear is used.

As a general starting tip, I would slow your BPM down and bring your levels up. Maybe work painfully slow and establish textures you like, then bring the tempo up to a point you want?

As a tip regarding your journey with sound design, it is often beneficial to step outside your comfort zone in order to learn.

Honestly, eliminating a fixed tempo and just dealing with raw sound for a bit can do wonders for your perception of the more structured works.
Thanks for the tips this was exactly what i was looking for! Just anything to start me out and then I can experiment from there. I have been toying around for a while but I love to see other people's approach to production.
melkobukva wrote:
Tue May 01, 2018 6:47 am
You have everything you need, maybe even too much.

Really learn the stuff you own, and it will get you there.

DON'T buy any more gear until you record at least 10 albums. It will only distract you.

Seriously.
I definitely agree I don't have the money for anything else!
WhiteWarlock wrote:
Tue May 01, 2018 7:14 am

Agree with him
crank it down for 40-60bpm
(oh wait that's writing doom:P)
experiment
totally unchain yourself completely from the computer sequencer clock
think more of old methods recording with tape
use your internal clock
feel it
become the sound
Thank you for the advice these types of little tips are great and lead to to a different perspective in music production.
Bipolar Fucking Joe wrote:
Tue May 01, 2018 7:38 am
I've never used an OP, so I dunno its capabilities. Run some drum sounds out of it through a distortion, on to cassette, then sample it back in. Death Grips just compresses the shit out of everything. Crochambeau said it best, really, your equipment can make any music if you use it to make that music.
I have a DS1 which is pretty shitty for guitar imo but probably perfect for synths! Since the OP1 goes on 3.5 I just haven't gotten around to getting the adapter for this. Thanks for the tips! Maybe I'll even try to just compress the shit out of a something.
Fletcher wrote:
Tue May 01, 2018 7:41 am
Hah, agree with the low tempo stuff. Try and make less before making more.

These guys from russia make techno at 80bpm and it slays

https://soundcloud.com/somatik-sounds
This is such a simple idea but so funny to me, thanks for the share!
WhiteWarlock wrote:
Tue May 01, 2018 7:51 am
old trick so they can manually program double time quad time based off the lower BPM
way more room for working with when composing
better "note resolution"
example: 60 becomes 120 becomes 240 with how you program notes
allows for way more intricate programming
at lower bpm
especially for "Techno"
yet you get that
Thank you for this again! I now have at least a couple hours of just noodling with shit purely based on forum tips.
crochambeau wrote:
Tue May 01, 2018 8:24 am
Avoid falling into the mindset that each sound needs an equal space or weight carved for it.
This is really interesting to me, I have been really focusing on tone and where it fits in the space maybe I am obsessing
WhiteWarlock wrote:
Tue May 01, 2018 9:53 am
always avoided teenage engineering OP1
something about it is completely turns me off
it's the plastic looking apple "interace"
not into "new gear" tiny interaces cramped esthetiques
yet looked at the specs today
and obviously you should be able making that work
especially with pedals
the big question is how the edit navigation & real time controls

is the 4-tracktape feature quantized/locked with midi sequencer?
This has been my biggest gripe on getting into making this music. For the time being I am just setting that issue aside and trying to just learn synthesizers and even DAWs and Midi Instruments just so I can make the type of tone/sound/music I want to, and at that point I'll worry more about how to produce it live, "edit navigation & real time controls". That is absolutely my biggest goal but for the time being I just want to make sure it's worth me jumping down the rabbit hole anyways.

As far as the OP1 Im not sure if Im wrong or not but I can use it as a midi keyboard but I don't think I can quantize them together? maybe I'm wrong but so far i haven't got around to using it with my computer which is kinda older and doesn't keep up with real time recording very well. So I just use it to record into, not interact with (the daw)
s.p.i.n. wrote:
Tue May 01, 2018 10:15 am
WhiteWarlock wrote:
Tue May 01, 2018 9:53 am
something about it is completely turns me off
the price
price is a huge turn off, and perhaps a bad tax return decision i made a couple years ago hahaha... i hope to one day feel like I got the amount of money I spent into it out of it but we will see.. I will say it is made of metal! @WhiteWarlock if you ever hold one it definitely will make sense why people defend these things so much, it just feels so great in your hand honestly.
xdugef wrote:
Tue May 01, 2018 11:55 am
No it is not impossible.

I have an OP1 and I haven't done a huge amount of work with it but it's a fairly powerful device for sampling, sequencing and processing audio.

I suppose probably the biggest drawback to it is that unlike working on a computer you may be limited on how many different tracks you could work on at a time.

Anyway having said that I have not been motivated to force myself to try doing a full composition using just the OP1 because I have so many other devices to play with.
In my case the OP1 may be the only "real" instrument I have but so far has been too overwhelming for me to learn not coming from a synthesizer background. Right now I am more-so focusing on how that works before getting into advanced features of the OP1 without feeling a bit lost.


TL;DR Thank you all for the tips and replies, I always love to see different perspectives and approaches to music production and live recording. I also love having a forum to talk these things out, sometimes you just need to talk things out to see whats right in front of you and I appreciate all of your time reaching out and being so open to discussion! \,,/

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Re: My gear/advice wanted

Post by xdugef » Tue May 01, 2018 3:59 pm

drbenway wrote:
Tue May 01, 2018 3:13 pm
price is a huge turn off, and perhaps a bad tax return decision i made a couple years ago hahaha...
This is really debatable.. and relative.. plenty of people pay hundreds to thousands of dollars for a single device that does one thing. I have a number of eurorack modules that cost the same as the OP1 and none do as many things as the OP1.

The OP1 is a software synth, a sampler, a sequencer, a drum machine, a generative pattern maker, a 4 track, an effects box, a radio, a microphone and a simulated reel to reel deck.

Anyway.. you might beable to do all these things if you bought a cheap laptop and used open source audio software or used a smart phone or an ipad for the same price.. it is what it is.. it straddles the area of incredibly cool toy and actual production device. It's too expensive to be a toy and not high end enough to be taken seriously in a production environment.

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WhiteWarlock
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Re: My gear/advice wanted

Post by WhiteWarlock » Tue May 01, 2018 4:12 pm

use what you have
don't debate after the fact
make it work for you
get completely obsessed with that machine
live in it
push it's limits
make it submit for your will

drbenway
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Re: My gear/advice wanted

Post by drbenway » Tue May 01, 2018 4:26 pm

xdugef wrote:
Tue May 01, 2018 3:59 pm
drbenway wrote:
Tue May 01, 2018 3:13 pm
price is a huge turn off, and perhaps a bad tax return decision i made a couple years ago hahaha...
This is really debatable.. and relative.. plenty of people pay hundreds to thousands of dollars for a single device that does one thing. I have a number of eurorack modules that cost the same as the OP1 and none do as many things as the OP1.

The OP1 is a software synth, a sampler, a sequencer, a drum machine, a generative pattern maker, a 4 track, an effects box, a radio, a microphone and a simulated reel to reel deck.

Anyway.. you might beable to do all these things if you bought a cheap laptop and used open source audio software or used a smart phone or an ipad for the same price.. it is what it is.. it straddles the area of incredibly cool toy and actual production device. It's too expensive to be a toy and not high end enough to be taken seriously in a production environment.
Very well put, for me it was a mistake in that it cost more than my electric guitar but I get what you mean. I don't have a lot of money to spend i bought the OP1 because of its versatility I just know I haven't invested enough into learning it in and out.

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Re: My gear/advice wanted

Post by xdugef » Tue May 01, 2018 4:39 pm

drbenway wrote:
Tue May 01, 2018 4:26 pm
I just know I haven't invested enough into learning it in and out.
Sure.. I'm guilty of this too.. lately it often takes me a very long time to integrate new pieces of gear into my setup that I buy thinking they solve some issue or because they were just shiny.

Having said that I agree with "use what you have".. I know I could do something interesting with very little with some effort... or maybe not even much effort.. I mean doing field recording requires very little effort for example.

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WhiteWarlock
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Re: My gear/advice wanted

Post by WhiteWarlock » Tue May 01, 2018 5:34 pm

funny thing is you end up going through so much gear over time
especially if you are the type with tenacity that doesn't give up
you will find yourself go back for not forgetting "the basics"
so you can evolve onto next level
limit your palette
too many options=chaos & unproductivity
you have the OP1 as your main workstation machine
become supreme master of that machine
not the slave of the machine
don't give a flying rats ass about anyone else "opinions"
first & foremost listen for your own inner vox
with enough time & energy it will become zen like

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Fletcher
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Re: My gear/advice wanted

Post by Fletcher » Wed May 02, 2018 3:15 am

WhiteWarlock wrote:
Tue May 01, 2018 4:12 pm
use what you have
don't debate after the fact
make it work for you
get completely obsessed with that machine
live in it
push it's limits
make it submit for your will
solid advice, I have a self imposed gear ban in place right now, hoping it will last another 3 months at least. Went on a buying spree end of last year and I need to learn what I've got inside out before moving on.
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melkobukva
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Re: My gear/advice wanted

Post by melkobukva » Wed May 02, 2018 4:27 am

Gear Acquisition Syndrome is totally a thing :(

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Re: My gear/advice wanted

Post by Fletcher » Wed May 02, 2018 6:06 am

melkobukva wrote:
Wed May 02, 2018 4:27 am
Gear Acquisition Syndrome is totally a thing :(
Totally. I have had to uninstall the reverb app from my phone :wall: :wall:
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melkobukva
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Re: My gear/advice wanted

Post by melkobukva » Wed May 02, 2018 7:43 am

Very familiar! Getting too much stuff not because you need it, but because it looks interesting and fun to play with. As a result, a pile of pricey toys gathering dust, because that's already like two full setups worth of equipement or maybe more, and there's no chance it can be used all at once in any reasonable way.

The solution is to make twice as much noise! :idea:

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